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Can someone help me understand this debate that I’ve been seeing a lot?
Wasn’t sure what flair to use for this so I hope this is okay!
PSA:Okay so I’m not sure if this kind of thing that’s allowed on here since there seems to be a lot of division in the community over it so if this isn’t allowed just let me know and I’ll delete it(this is a long post because I’m terrible at summarizing things)
So basically I’ve been seeing a lot of debate online(TikTok especially) about whether trans men(not transmasc but specifically trans men) can be lesbians or not. Something I wanna make clear is that I would never attack someone for using labels that don’t make sense from my perspective because I understand there’s a lot of nuance to this conversation so I don’t want to encourage hate to either side of the argument.
I’m a nonbinary lesbian(I’m afab so for me I feel more connected to the lesbian label than the gay or trixic labels especially taking into account how femininity influences my gender expression)
To me, I see lesbian as being a non-man attracted to non-men(women and identities under the nonbinary umbrella). So the idea of trans men being included under the lesbian label just doesn’t make sense to me because one of the key aspects of being a lesbian is that it excludes men(and as trans men are also men, it just doesn’t seem right).
I’ve seen people say that because of the history of trans men being included in lesbian spaces means that they can still be considered lesbians if that’s how they identify but I feel like that argument leaves out some key details.
Lesbians and trans men ofc had a connection because of both groups being queer and afab, but the reason trans men were called lesbians wasn’t because they necessarily wanted to be, it was because people didn’t see them as real men back then. The solidarity between trans men and lesbians is very real but in my opinion that doesn’t mean that trans men can be lesbians by association.
Ofc i understand trans men who still hold onto the lesbian label while in the closet or earlier on in their transition because that’s the label they were using before and that’s what they’re used to.
Idk am I missing some sort of context for why some people think this? I’ve been called bigoted for not thinking trans men can be lesbians and if that’s true I want to be better but I just don’t understand why that would make me bigoted.
Like I said before, no matter how someone identifies, even if I don’t understand it, I don’t send any hate to anyone, identity is very personal and can be complicated so I get it.
So no matter what pls just be respectful to each other in the replies and pls understand that I’m not attacking anyone I’m just trying to understand this perspective in the debate.
#adult
source
Wasn’t sure what flair to use for this so I hope this is okay!
PSA:Okay so I’m not sure if this kind of thing that’s allowed on here since there seems to be a lot of division in the community over it so if this isn’t allowed just let me know and I’ll delete it(this is a long post because I’m terrible at summarizing things)
So basically I’ve been seeing a lot of debate online(TikTok especially) about whether trans men(not transmasc but specifically trans men) can be lesbians or not. Something I wanna make clear is that I would never attack someone for using labels that don’t make sense from my perspective because I understand there’s a lot of nuance to this conversation so I don’t want to encourage hate to either side of the argument.
I’m a nonbinary lesbian(I’m afab so for me I feel more connected to the lesbian label than the gay or trixic labels especially taking into account how femininity influences my gender expression)
To me, I see lesbian as being a non-man attracted to non-men(women and identities under the nonbinary umbrella). So the idea of trans men being included under the lesbian label just doesn’t make sense to me because one of the key aspects of being a lesbian is that it excludes men(and as trans men are also men, it just doesn’t seem right).
I’ve seen people say that because of the history of trans men being included in lesbian spaces means that they can still be considered lesbians if that’s how they identify but I feel like that argument leaves out some key details.
Lesbians and trans men ofc had a connection because of both groups being queer and afab, but the reason trans men were called lesbians wasn’t because they necessarily wanted to be, it was because people didn’t see them as real men back then. The solidarity between trans men and lesbians is very real but in my opinion that doesn’t mean that trans men can be lesbians by association.
Ofc i understand trans men who still hold onto the lesbian label while in the closet or earlier on in their transition because that’s the label they were using before and that’s what they’re used to.
Idk am I missing some sort of context for why some people think this? I’ve been called bigoted for not thinking trans men can be lesbians and if that’s true I want to be better but I just don’t understand why that would make me bigoted.
Like I said before, no matter how someone identifies, even if I don’t understand it, I don’t send any hate to anyone, identity is very personal and can be complicated so I get it.
So no matter what pls just be respectful to each other in the replies and pls understand that I’m not attacking anyone I’m just trying to understand this perspective in the debate.
#adult
source
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